Is classical better than other music?

Date: 
04/04/2012
Contributor: 

 

Not content with yesterday's sideways glance at this question, let's address it head-on today:  Is classical music better than any other kind?  I'll let you know what I think.  But I'm more interested in reading your thoughts, so please share.

My short answer is:  Sometimes, but not always.  And in some ways, but not in all ways.  For the ultimate in scale, in permanence and in profundity, the greatest classical works by the greatest classical composers are without equal.  To express oneself musically in large forms, big ideas, fine detail and maximum impact, classical music provides a tradition and a range of resources that other genres can't match, great as they can be.  There is no "jazz St. Matthew Passion", no "rock Beethoven 9th", no "Broadway Ring."  It's no coincidence, by the way, that the examples I chose are all German, for it's in the Austro-German tradition that the qualities I ascribed to classical music took their fullest form.  Not that there aren't other ways to think about classical music, thank goodness.

Now for some "buts."  But most classical music doesn't fulfill the above goals, or even strive for them.  But some classical music is frivolous, trashy, silly and made for fun.  But some classical music is a crashing bore.  But just slapping the "classical" label on your music doesn't make it better than other kinds.

Then, there are the things other kinds of music have that classical doesn't, at least to the same degree.  Jazz features — indeed, demands — spontaneous creativity and high-wire virtuosity uniquely its own, along with moments of passion, ecstasy and beauty to match any other art.  I can be more moved by a great cabaret singer doing pop standards than by a classical song recital — and I'm more likely to understand the words.  Same goes for Broadway (especially Sondheim) vs. opera.  And my recent forays into modern rock and pop, mostly of the "indie" variety, have at times left me speechless (believe it or not) at its creativity and emotional power.  As with my favorite classical pieces, I find new things in the best pop albums each time I listen, no matter how many spins I give them.  Again, please add your favorite music to my list (and please hip me to a CD or two).

It's another non-coincidence that each example in the previous paragraph is closer to the musical vernacular than most classical is.  That's a good and important thing.  For just as mutli-lingual people tend to revert to their mother tongue when expressing the deepest emotions, so do the musical styles we grew up with say something to us that no other kinds can.  Thus, the music that speaks the language of my first musical loves, pop and rock (jazz and classical came later) reaches me in a way that music that speaks the language of fin-de-siècle Vienna or 52nd Street in the '40s can't quite, though I love them too.

So I agree with those who insist that others who haven't tried classical music are missing out on one of life's richest pleasures.  But I believe just as fully that classical fans who wouldn't consider listening seriously to other kinds of music are making as big a mistake — and I wonder what other pleasures they're walling themselves from.

Please, please, please share your opinions and favorites!

 

Comments

Classical AND Fats Domino AND the Beatles AND ...

As a kid, I was exposed to lots of classical music and always loved it, plus mainstream pop music which I loved (1950's) in spite of my father's harangues; but hardly anything else. In high school I got into an argument with a kid who didn't know classical music but knew he hated it, and I promised to bring in a record for him to take home and listen to, but he said I also had to borrow one of his. I lent him Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet and he lent me Fats Domino's Strawberry Hill. I was about to say we both became converts, but that's not right, because we didn't give up our first loves, just added new loves! I'm with Peter Schickele: if it sounds great, it IS great!

And if I had stuck with only loving classical, how could I have enjoyed my kids' wonderful rock groups?

And the Beatles -- the Beatles rule! We're now a 3-generation Beatles-loving family, and now that I'm a great-grandmother, it will soon be four, I hope!

Cheers to you and to WFCR. I'm always in Moscow for half the year, and so glad to be able to keep listening through my computer!

When you traded Romeo and Juliet for Blueberry Hill...

...did you, in Chuck Berry's immortal words, "tell Tchaikovsky the news?"

 

Better?

from Jim Snedeker

What a loaded question!   Well, I can see how some people might say yes.  Classical has more of a lot of things and to a greater degree than other styles.  It has a wide variety of instruments, which lend to a large palate of texture and color; it has extreme subtlely and nuance; it has whispered pianissimos and thunderous fortissimos (and everything in between).  It can possess almost unbelievable complexity while still sounding accessible.  It has brilliant composers who have stood the test of time (anywhere from 50 to 500 years).   No other music has remained "popular" for so long.

But then look at jazz.  Jazz has all of these things but on a smaller scale. Timbres and colors are different (due to the different instrumentation), but therein lies what makes the music jazz rather than classical.   And jazz musicians improvise much of the time, which classical musicians don't do.   A classical musician is beholden to what the composer has written on the page; jazz soloists aren't.  Thus the jazz musician is not only the player but also the composer.  Could that make the jazz musician "better" than the classical musician?

Look at rock.  Long maligned by classical and jazz lovers alike, it has its own vocabulary.  Most rock musicians are also massive improvisers, preferring to work out their music collaboratively in jam sessions similar to jazz players.   The obvious difference is the instrumentation: electric, amped-up instruments as opposed to acoustic.  This doesn't mean the music is necessarily less sophisticated than classical or jazz; it means that rock music creates a different type of atmosphere.  The old joke is the line, "Why does it have to be so loud?"  The reason is because that's how rock music expresses itself, with volume and excitement.   Much rock music is meant to be loud, period; if you tried to play it not loud, it would sound silly.  And another thing rock has going for it that classical and improvised jazz don't: you can dance to rock. 

But what about all the other styles of music?   Country.   Bluegrass.  Disco.  Pop.  Reggae.  Crooner.   Heavy metal.  You could go on and on.   The bottom line is that each type of music has its own vocabulary and way of expressing itself.   And some people will like some of them, and some people won't.   But that doesn't mean anything when it comes to what makes a music "better" than another.  Every style of music has two thigns in common:  it demands that the player knows how to play it, and the listener knows how to appreciate and enjoy it. 

It all comes down to personal taste and the lift we can get in the moment that a particular style of music can give us.  I remember when I was in my college jazz band and we were driving home one night from a gig.   We were all exhausted after playing high-intensity jazz for two hours and were enjoying relaxing in the car on our five-hour drive back home.  Someone suggested we put on the local jazz radio station.  After a moment, we almost all said, "No!  Put on Top 40!"   The point is that what we wanted and needed was not more complex, intellectual music at the moment:  we wanted simpler, easier-to-listen to music.  We said no to cerebral, elaborately rhythmic and colorful jazz.  Classical would have also been way too complex, brainy, and, quite frankly too pompous for us at that time.  At that moment, Top 40, with its catchy melodies, simple harmonies, and infectious beat,  was indeed better than any other music we could ask for.

 

 

Thanks...

...for taking to time for such a thoughtful reply, Jim.  Just remember that the "Top 40" from my youth — from, say, 1962 to 1967 —is of course the greatest of all time, and that it went seriously downhill after I stopped listening.  Right?

 

Well, my youth was the early

Well, my youth was the early to mid-70s and while the music definitely changed from the hippie-style, it still churned out some great tunes.   Too many to mention, but the style really evolved.  I'm thinking of the "Philadelphia Sound" of the O'Jays, Motown certainly, the soul of Al Green, and so many other absolutely wonderful creative artitsts.  It's when Michael Jackson got his start to superstardom, and Elton John came on the scene.   Neil Diamond continued to evolve and we saw Barbra Streisand become a multi-gold artist.  Even the hokey artists sold millions of records:  DeFranco Family ("Heartbeat It's a Lovebeat"); Starland Vocal Band ("Afternoon Delight"), and the Partridge Family (several top hits).  I listen to these records with fresh ears today and they have so much going for them besides their simple catchy refrains.

Mid-70s, we launch into disco, and even that had a lot to recommend it.   These were some of the best recordings ever made, because even of the music itself wasn't especially elaborate, they always hired the best session musicians and the best producers.  I could listen to Donna Summer's "MacArthur Park Suite" forever, because it's full to the brim with lush chords, interesting rhythmic hits and a ton of virtuoso playing going on in with the guitar, bass, and percussion.  I think the one big thing disco did was bring back dancing to popular music, which really hadn't held sway since the 1940s!

I enjoyed the Top 40 of the 80s, but love it even more now!   The music evolved from the string backgrounds and vocal reverb of the 70s to a more flat sound with almost no beds, brought on by people like Debbie Harry and Madonna.  New Wave and Punk came into vogue.   From a techncial musical standpoint, it wasn't elaborate, but it was innovative.   And still more new groups came on the scene, way too many to mention.  Even the one-hit wonder groups deserve credit for making it a memorable time that provided many lasting memories of tuneful songs.

I began to lose it in the 90s with rap, which I have started to get but still don't totally understand.   It was new and innovative, but the lack of a melody plus the "public service announcement" nature of a lot of its lyrics made me keep my distance.  But then again, wasn't much of the music of the 60s "PSA" in nature?    The circle is complete.

 

Is classical better?

I love what you wrote and completely agree.  Beethoven's music is my absolute favorite,  but I myself sing traditional Anglo-American folk music which ranges from sweet to saucy, sad to celebratory, with both lively and lyrical tunes. It satisfies on a different level.  And I am also a huge fan of banjoist  Béla Fleck,   whose musical mind is wide open and who plays music of many different styles (including classical).  There is a lot of incredible music outside the classical realm for those who are willing to explore. 

"It satisfies on a different level."

Well put, thanks.

Turning the question around a bit

This is an interesting question, asked in an interesting way - but my intial reaction is to turn it on its head a bit and ask instead: Is classical music enough? I'm not a  classical music afficianato but I do appreciate having access to it on WFCR, and am often introduced to music I'd never hear otherwise. 

However, I'm often left wondering if it is enough. With so much increadible and diverse music out there (even just in our Valley alone) I think the quality and worth of any single genre is expanded when considered within the larger field. We understand indie rock better when we hear it juztaposed with jazz and classical, when we are able to explore the connections and conflicts they present. I'd agree with your last point that we should not limit ourselves to listening with care to only one kind of music.

To that end, I'd love to see WFCR expand its music programming beyond the amazing classical and jazz offereings currently availble. I've loved the work MN public radio has done with "The Current" and PRX's work with "Remix Radio" and of course nationally NPR has become a game changer in music of all genres.  There are many other amazing examples from local stations in the NPR Music Month blog here

Given the dismal state of commerical music radio - and the huge population of young people in WFCR's listening area (an attractive demographic for some underwriters) - there seems to be some unique opportunities here.  

Thanks for asking the question - I look forard to hearing what other music fans in Western Mass think.

 

Thanks for the comment.  I'd

Thanks for the comment.  I'd love for there to be more diverse programming in the area as well, but not at the expense of the classical and jazz we already do.  In fact, we at NEPR would love to do more of them all!  But while never ceasing to look for ways to expand our offerings through more radio and other platforms, we have to work now with what we've got.  And for now, 'tis better to concentrate on doing a few things really well than trying to do lots more things less well.

Thanks John

One of the things that set's public radio apart is the commitment, across all kinds of programming, to doing "things really well." 

Is "Classical" Music better?

I’ve always wondered whether music other than “classical” can provide others the deep spiritual nourishment I get from classical music. How do you measure or judge this response in others? You don’t. But you could ask yourself whether you’re receiving from music something more profound than entertainment. And if you’re making a deep emotional connection, is the connection with the words or truly with the music? Is it a connection that will sustain you throughout your lifetime, something you can return to again and again, always finding something new and meaningful in it? Is it music that others are continuing to listen to decades after it was written? Is it music that other performers perform and reveal new facets of, or is it music that is dependent on the original performer and has no life beyond that performance? For me, only “classical” music and some theatre music and a bit of jazz, satisfy these criteria. Therefore, for me, classical music is “better”.

 

Mark

Mark, I can tell you that my

Mark, I can tell you that my answer to your first question is "yes".  And by bringing up the distinction between profundity and entertainment, you've touched on an issue I've thought about too.  I listen to some classical music for sheer enterainment.  And I find profundity in some pop/rock.  For instance, I can't listen to Neutral Milk Hotel's "In the Aeroplane Over the Sea" without being deeply moved.   On the other hand, you might find "Aeroplane" to be unlistenably crude, and I woudn't deny the validity of your reaction.  Same goes with the 60's psych band Love's "Forever Changes," which I only discovered almost 40 years after it was recorded, listened to obsessively for a whole summer, and still return to with deep emotional and aesthetic pleasure.  That may not make either album the objective equivalent of "Das Lied von der Erde" — but I wouldn't call either a mere "entertainment."  And to me, in my life of music, they're every bit as meaningful as Mahler.

And p.s., if a piece of music is not at some level entertaining, I don't want to hear it.

Everyone has good points

Everyone has good points here. What an interesting conversation! The consensus seems to be that different music serves different puposes, each great and neccesary in their own ways. And further that within each genre there is music that satisfies different purposes. So it seems that the only way to answer Mr Montanari's original question "Is classical music better than other music?" one must answer for oneself another question (although it sounds almost absurd, it really gets you thinking) "If you were stranded on a desert island and you could only have classical music, jazz (and with jazz let's throw in all the other high-level improvised music traditions) or popular music, which would you take?" Well, which would YOU take. Don't question the question, I know it's got issues, just answer it.

Joe

Listen to us on: 88.5 FM Amherst / Springfield / Hartford | 101.1 FM Adams / North Adams | 98.7 FM Great Barrington | 98.3 FM Lee | 106.1 FM Pittsfield / Lenox | 96.3 FM Williamstown | AM 640 all-news WNNZ, Westfield | 91.7 FM all-news WNNZ, Deerfield | 89.5 FM all-news WNNU, Southern Berkshire County | 88.5-HD WFCR in HD | 88.5-HD2 all-classical in HD